Ya I hear you and agree with most all of this. I did choose Clojure in part because it had Java interop so on some level I knew I’d need to learn a bunch of Java and APIs to take advantage of that. I think it’s a great design decision but also am actually kind of a fan of wrappers - I think being able to use raw Java is great and sometimes the right choice but I also appreciate even the half baked wrappers sometimes. As to the original article I should probably read it :-) I was jumping into the discussion more to address this chip on my shoulder about wrappers.