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If you're going to use highly subjective frequentist statistics at all, p < 0.001 should be the minimum gold standard for extraordinary claims. If the phenomenon is real, and not bad statistics, it only requires two and a half times as many subjects to get p < 0.001 instead of p < 0.05. Physicists, who don't want to have to put up with this crap, use p < 0.0001. p < 0.05 is asking for trouble.


A complication is that if the effect were real, all our ideas of prior vs. posterior probability would need re-thinking. The hypothesis is that humans can be influenced by posterior events. That includes the experimenters.


Ok, then let's funding psychology like we fund physics. I would love to run 1000+ patient studies to test psychotherapies, and in fact we'd be able to answer some really interesting questions if we did, but there is currently no way of doing this.


I repeat, you do not need 1000 times as many subjects to get results that are 1000 times as significant! If 40 subjects gets you results with p < 0.05, then 100 subjects should get you results with p < 0.001. Doing half as many experiments and having nearly all the published results being real effects, instead of most of them failing to replicate when tested, sounds like a great tradeoff to me.

And I suspect the ultimate reason it's not done this way... is that scientists in certain fields would publish a lot fewer papers, not slightly fewer but a lot fewer, if all the effects they were studying had to be real.


"1000+", not "1000x". Also, I'm assuming bigfudge was talking about p < 0.0001, given the comparison made to physicists.


Yes - thanks. The current norm for a 'suitably powered' trial of a psychotherapy is about 300. We've just got a trial funded for that number (admittedly in a challenging patient population) which will cost about £2.5m in research and treatment costs. We would love to run 1000 patients and start looking at therapist-client interactions, individual differences in treatment suitability but that's out of the question.


Let's fund psychology like that when the psychologists define their hypotheses before the experiment begins as well as physicists do.


That's a cheap shot. Our trial will publish a detailed protocol and analysis plan, as do most large, publicly funded trials. Small-scale experimental work is a different matter. I personally agree that all experiments which could end up in peer reviewed journals should be registered before participants are recruited.

This would be simple to do by submitting ethics applications and an analysis plan to a trusted third party which would only release them once the author is in a position to publish, or at a pre-agreed cutoff (perhaps 2 years), whichever is the shorter (to avoid scooping). Perhaps I should set something up...


Having moved from physics to biology, I am amazed with the difference in what the consensus of 'significant' is. Some of the difference is due to necessity, but not all.


There are more reasons to doubt our results, so we lower our standards of evidence?


Sounds reasonable.

When some people find that their model doesn't quite fit, they make a more accurate model. Others make a less specific model. It's the difference between model parametrization and model selection.

So when we get a dubious result, we can either say "no result" or "possible result". The choice tends to depend on how the finding affects future research. Biology is more exploratory than confirmatory, so they go that way.




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